i haven't really got much to write about lately.. its raining outside, but i don't feel down. October is a nice month really, i always feel like its the calm before the long nights draw in and the real cold begins.
I always get out the winter clothes around now, make space in a draw and get rid of the twins summer clothes. October is always a month where things change isn't it? The trees are slowly becoming orange, the strange party feel about life that you get in the summer is gone. There is still a nice scent in the air of what once was, but its blowing away in the wind..
I'd really love the autumn, but I know that winters coming along soon.
i used to like winter when i was little. we used to get snow back then? what has happend to it all, we never get any anymore. Snow always made the place look so pretty. I remember i used to wake up every winter morning with my fingers crossed that it had snowed! i opened the curtain and... nope.. it hadn't oh well, maybe tommorow.
anyway, you know sometimes when you get involved in things and you eventually come out of it? you look back and think... amazing, did i really believe in that? i'm a bit like that now..
i think that im in october in more than just the date on the top of the page. Its a time of change in my life, the way i feel about the world is changing.
recently, i've been lost inbetween feeling pretty down in the dumps, looking after children, trying to show my partner how important and how much i love him, while getting mixed up in a strange cult like movement called the male rights movement (mrm).
i don't really know how i got involved in it, but i know that at the beginning i was actually quite frightened by the mrm and thought i'd better find out what it was about. I had always felt that some things weren't fair to the male gender, and suspected that they might have a case sometimes. Not to mention the things that are unfair to women, and its about time i started talking about that more.. but, it's true, some things aren't fair to them.
the problem men have, is almost always they have brought it on themselves. I see the mrm as a movement of lonely people, when they write, i can feel the pain that they have in their lives. They don't understand that life is about life. Its about the moment, not the future..
you know what? i was completely wrong to be scared of them.
the mrm are no threat to anyone, they are really just another bunch of people lost in their own head and have an inability to relate properly to the rest of the world. Its part of the human condition i suppose, im not saying they are bad people, just misguided. When people are selfish, it eventually shines through and you'd have to be really stupid not to see it in the mrm. Im not saying that there aren't lots of stupid people out there, bless them, but, there is something in the macho psyche, that makes them completely unaware of how the rest of the world views them.
you know what? i actually quite like the world as it is, im pretty happy at the moment. I suspect those people aren't. I think thats why im drawn to them, its in my nature to want to understand and feel other peoples pain. I dont know why im like that, nobody can ever feel mine... but you know, there is no world wide conspiracy against them.. its because.. well.. they are men who forgot how to enjoy life. it seems to me, they are incapable of having fun anymore.
I suppose that they walk down the road, and look at everything they hate about the world. They look at women like me, and they hate us because we exist? They don't see the hanging basket with the geraniums outside the house, they missed it. Its gone now.. Thats what im trying to say, that feeling bad, is about focusing on bad things. What have we done to them? we haven't done anything, we, just like anyone else, are just trying to get on with our lives in the best way we know. If you look for the bad in the world, you will find it. Its important to know that my sunshine.
I'm still drawn to them though, i admit that.. i'm always interested in people and their wierd worlds, but i think thats where my interest finishes now? The summer has now gone and the world is beginning to change again. I dont think that there is any reason to be afraid of that is there?
It takes humility and sensitivity to make a good world for yourself. Extreme people in my opinion, dont know how to do this, or they forgot about it.. you know, it's not about competition, its about understanding isnt it?
What i can say to people lost in the bad feeling of any group like the mrm, is that when you talk about loyalty, you mean intolerance. When you talk about brothers, you mean slaves. When you talk about women, you mean people who are trying to be happy. If you are really that intellegent, why are you in the situation you are in? Have you asked yourself that? why can't you hear what im saying..
its october, and things change. but it has to come from the inside, not from the outside.
next time you walk down the road, don't hate me. Why do you all hate me? Remember that i told you to look at the flowers. remember that you can choose to see the good in life, but you have to know that there is no party.. there is no crowd cheering you on. It's about noticing the flowers, instead of seeing the storm coming in. Next time you feel hate, remember me, and look for the flowers..
35 comments:
C'mon Fruit Cake, nobody hates you. How many people post on AM, 15? 3 of them are women who only bash you as a way of sucking up to the guys, 2 of them are retarded, 1 is a lunatic with a fetish for any woman who resides in a 2nd world country, 2 of them like you and the rest just are frustrated trying to explain themselves to you.
Like I said on AM, anybody who doesn't like you, it is their loss. Don't take anything you read on any internet message board personally.
P.S.: thanks for linking to my blog. Unfortunately it hasn't helped and nobody is reading it.
P.P.S.: I am not a MikeUSA fan. I think he is insane and I feel sorry for him. It would make me look bad if I criticized him on my blog though.
P.P.P.S: I just saw an English film called "This is England". It was stupid. Tell your countrymen to start making better movies.
Lovely writing as ever FC!!
2 of them are retarded, 1 is a lunatic with a fetish for any woman who resides in a 2nd world country, 2 of them like you and the rest just are frustrated trying to explain themselves to you.
i so want to know who the 2,1 and 2 are.. you're the worst gossip otis!
2 retarded.. hmm i know at least one, but two? i'll have to think about that.. drex, your not particularly bothered about which country are you?
thanks for linking to my blog. Unfortunately it hasn't helped and nobody is reading it.
your welcome, and well er.. its only been there five minutes otis, you have to give yourself a chance. Anyway, it should be a place for you to say things that go round in your head?
just like a merry-go-round! you can go up and down, and smile!
if people comment on it or not doesn't really matter, but give them a chance. I want to see where its all going, so i'll pay attention.
mikeusa? i recognise the name.. isn't he one of those 'im gonna cut you all up into little peices one by one' type of mra?
Tell your countrymen to start making better movies.
are english films that bad? oh my god i had no idea. The last film i liked was pan's laberinth and that was spanish
Lovely writing as ever FC!!
thanks andrex, gizza snog xxxx
the 2 retards are Celtic Dumbass and TheButtPirateOnTheStreet. Who were you guessing?
I feel sorry for the creepy fetishist so I won't name him, I don't even have a problem with him, I just think he is weird. But as you have probably noticed, the Men's Movement is flypaper for weirdos. Our movement really is a mess.
The two who like you are me and drex. Did you think I meant there were two people at AM who liked you besides us two? I'm pretty sure that isn't the case. But most of the other guys there are nice people and don't really dislike you, they just think your obnoxious.
I just saw that you asked who MikeUSA is. Fruitcake, you commented on his blog. It was in response to one of his (many) posts in which he advocates grown men marrying 13yr old girls. Ring any bells?
His blog recently got shut down and since I condemned that I thought you might think I was a fan of his, and I just wanted to make sure that you knew that I wasn't. Apparently that was unnecessary as you don't even remember him.
the 2 retards are Celtic Dumbass and TheButtPirateOnTheStreet. Who were you guessing?
well dearest celtic was one of them, but he says that his brain only works at 15% so he agrees with us!
i feel sorry for him, but don't tell him that..
The man on the street! - oh yeah, he wasn't important enough to come to mind otis, i guess he's too busy on the street, belly dancing or something.
The two who like you are me and drex.
drex likes everyone, so he doesn't count! but its nice you do too.
They think im obnoxious? well there we go. they're right! I'm obnoxious and they're cobpopxious!
the Men's Movement is flypaper for weirdos. Our movement really is a mess.
yeah, but thats a good thing. Do you really want people like those two getting into power, really?
i think the mrm is a mix of two types of men, one is a normal guy, probably had a bad experience with a woman or two and needs somewhere to talk about it... the other is a deranged macho madman, who won't stop until he's proven how big his penis is to the rest of the world, in various different guises..
Didn't poor old celtic realise, that his is automatically bigger than mine by default? haha. He can keep it, and stick it through one of those holes in the gay toilets..
you know, they're all in bed together along with a few strange women who are trying to be just like the people who abused them when they were young.
its a big bed and i reckon that the sheets must be a bit smelly by now!
I just saw that you asked who MikeUSA is
i remember him, when i hear his name i think of a church? why is that? but that was ages ago i can't remember what i wrote.
i don't know why you want to seperate us all out from each other, but then thats your thing. Only 5 months ago, i was in support of the mens movement, and now, im completely against it!
lucia vega,
I actually read these comments down to here because I thought I might be named the lunatic female on AM.
You know, (that's my guess what) I have struggled myself with the men's movement. Not actually the MRM but men themselves. I know they get on other sites and rip me to pieces. They have always done it.
And I know that some are just wanting to use me for their own personal gains. Revenge and egos is not my thing.
But it doesn't stop me from what I am trying to achieve. And I know there are really nice guys in the MRM also. They have always been understanding of my struggle and have always encouraged me to keep going. So I am passing encouragement on to you. Keep going. And try not to be so tough on yourself. Keep plodding away. Something attracts you to the MRM. It will all click in time. And most men have themselves been a fool on the sites at some stage.
If you are interested, this is something written for my city by a man who has worked closely with the feminists for years.
menz
Check out the report in comment 6 if you have a spare moment.
Gosh, I am not calling you a fool in my above comment. I had really only caught the end of your disagreement and seen one of your posts.
dont worry julie, otis and i were really just having a bit of fun.
But it doesn't stop me from what I am trying to achieve....They have always been understanding of my struggle
what are you trying to achieve julie, and what is your struggle??
julie, one of the stupidest things i ever did was be seduced into thinking that men could ever answer any of my problems.
i hope that you are not following the same path that i took, that you will not find what it is your looking for.
Hi Lucia Vega,
what are you trying to achieve julie, and what is your struggle??
julie, one of the stupidest things i ever did was be seduced into thinking that men could ever answer any of my problems.
I can answer both those questions together. And BTW, it is nice you ask me. It is nicer than having people make up their own minds.
I started off in this to learn about men's support. And to be a support because I work with single parents. Single parents are both the male and female. We don't go on who has most access to their children.
But along the way, I did heal. I have spent most of my life pining for my father. You could say that I am damaged because of PAS. Parental Alienation Syndrome. Not now though. The men have healed that for me. Everything makes sense in my life now.
I do what I do for the love of my father I never can have. I was told he was dead until I had a nightmare at the age of 10 which was a true event being the last time I saw my father. I grew up with a huge hole inside of me and spent my life trying to fill it up.
I do this so that my legacy will be to save other females and males going through what I have been through. And for the fathers and mothers who have their children ripped from the arms.
We all pick a road in our lives socailly and what we have been through is often a popular choice. This is much more important for me than trying to save the planet or the whales. And like most normal people, we all have something we care about doing besides being an individual and parents ourselves.
I know you will find what you need. We all do in the end.
julie, it must be very difficult growing up without a father, i guess you must have a constant never ending sense of loss, we are surrounded by families all the time, a constant reminder of what you have missed out on.
i grew up with both parents, and have been influenced alot by my dad, but, becareful that you have not created an unrealistic dream of what men are.
some men are good, but others run away from their children, and even worse, abuse them.
Its funny how its always men that end up without the children. They complain and complain, but you know why that is?
because in general, men don't want their children and are quite happy for them to go to the mother.
Always remember too, that for some people, growing up without a father is much better than growing up with an abusive father.
the mrm would have us believe that men are wonderful creatures who build cities and lookafter children, who love women and protect their families..
its rubbish. They believe their own propaganda. The truth is they are generally hollow individuals, with little or no ability to form meaningful relationships with women. They feel hurt and they are out for revenge.
don't be seduced by it, there are good men out there, but most of them are happily married with children. They certainly are not involved in the mrm.
men as a group offer no future whatsoever for either themselves, women or our children.
men have never known how to look after themselves or their children properly. Why should we suddenly expect them to change what is in their nature?
if you want to see where this is all going, all you have to do is go and live in iran.
women in the western world are so lucky. We are forgetting the sacrifices made for us by feminism 50 and 100 years ago.
Maybe feminism needs adjustments, but it is the only future that represents anything positive at all, either for men, women or children.
Lucia Vega,
Ouch. Your comment would hurt if you said it about women.
Not even the women who work in the women's refuges are as ruthless as you on this. lol
I will come back after work.
I'm back and have given your comment some thought today. But I will start with this part because you do seem to care for others.
it must be very difficult growing up without a father, i guess you must have a constant never ending sense of loss, we are surrounded by families all the time, a constant reminder of what you have missed out on.
I can't say it was difficult because I knew no different. All I knew was that I was lied to and that I was loved by someone who I really needed growing up. My mother did a great job raising me (eldest) and my 5 siblings. Unfortunately there is one thing you notice big time in a single parent family and that is that you lose your right to be a child. One parent doesn't have the support and nearly always the children play a parent role. This is coming out in research especially around boys because they are becoming 'the man of the house.' But they are not a man because they have no man to teach them how to be a man. They become mummies boys instead and 80% of our prisoners are from single parent families. Something is wrong with this picture.
The rest of your comment is fair to me and I can understand where you are coming from. I am no blind woman. lol
The funny thing here is that you are helping me with this misunderstanding also. This is a bit of my struggle.
But I am thinking that males know what males are about. More than you or I do.
I think they are also harder on each other. Men are not going to fall for the BS of another male. So I doubt very much if men get rights equal to women's right that they will abuse them as we have.
Feminism is about changing men to be more feminine. OK, sure I will admit I like that idea. But as you say, Maybe feminism needs adjustments
It sure does. We should let the men sort out the men. We are running around in fear of what they will do when in fact we should be welcoming what they would do.
They DO know what to do about violence in men. We do not need to be making laws and such to force them to think of us. We force it on them all when in fact we are just targeting a small number.
Maybe we both need to lighten up a little.
BTW, do you have a son as I do?
i have two daughters julie, they keep me busy most of the day, but sometimes i get five minutes to have a cup of tea and say something on here..
i dont know, its all very complicated isn't it?
Yes it is complicated. I nag a little at the men who are in charge at council level and above and in community groups. The ones who are working for men's rights say to me, "What do you want for us to do? This is not an easy thing to solve."
I guess it isn't when Domestic Violence research has only been going on for 20 years. The women want a shot and a good long term shot. Rome wasn't built in a day.
But then too many men are getting a rough deal. Violence in the homes really are from both partners in many situations. Like goes with like. But slowly things are changing. Women now a days are being raised masculine and the males today are being raised feminine. And all the while we are focusing on women being less capable to harm than the men.
We are soon as societies to be kicked in the teeth from feminism. But it doesn't want to stop. It thinks it can make it work in time. But time means many generations because as feminists see it, the Patriarchy has been present for thousands of years.
Me, myself am not happy to look at life this way. I think that you, me and every other living being is too important to be looked at as just some part of history.
I will not sit on the fence and watch. Too many people are doing this.
Tell me, as you seem to be a teacher. How many children do you have in class that live in single parent families? And how well are they coping compared to 2 parent families?
i teach older kids, 16+ and adults julie, i've taught in schools before but i never liked it, i feel that its more like a highly paid babysitter than anything else.
I live in an area that has a very high proportion of single parents. Not surprisngly, its one of the worst crime areas of one of the worst cities in the UK.
Single parent families are not ideal, but what i do know, is that its not the women who are running away from their children. When i say single parent families, i should say, one parent, absent father families.
MRA's do not want to know about this. They complain alot about child support payments, but, they never acknowledge that in 90% of cases, the father wants NOTHING to do with his children.
Men, in general, do not want to look after children. Yet, they complain when women are favoured.
Its a question of get your own ship in order first, boys!
I personally feel strongly that what you are doing is good. Children need good parents, and two is always better than one.
Being married to a spanish man, i also understand that in non-anglo saxon countries, there is alot more support and tolerance for children than in places like britain, or the states, or i imagine New Zealand.
Single parent families dont exist in spain really, and even if they do, they get massive support from their families. In Britain, people are left to fend for themselves. Here we have 16 year old girls with no life experience and nobody to help them trying to bring up their children. Its no wonder we face such an ill-mannered, rude and disrespectful new generation.
Being a mother, i know that on my own, i would stuggle alot more and keeping my temper, would become alot more difficult. My girls can be very tiring at times and I don't always have the energy to do things totally right.
However, don't be fooled that the mrm has any solutions to anything.
the mrm, as i've said before, cares nothing about women, or children. It only cares about men, and then, only the men that parrot its propaganda.
There are some very lost women mixed up in it, who want to believe in something, they want to believe in men. They are very much mistaken and one day will regret becoming traitors to their own kind. They are not aware of where women have come from, and how much we have to lose.
Feminism needs adjusting, and its not perfect, perhaps you might think about how it could be changed to promote families better. Women like us need to make things better, i think feminists have got lost, but not at the expense of ourselves or more importantly our children.
It would be a real shame to lose someone like you julie to the red faced, bigoted, feminine intolerant anger that is the mrm.
They are no movement, they are a collection of individuals, each with their own score to settle against either women, or the state.
The truth is, the only one they have to blame is themselves.
also julie, if you remember, i wrote this in reply to your "friend" fidelbogen,
Feminism is not perfect, far from it, and we need to include family men as part of our movement. Its a sad world when men are not allowed to sit next to children on a plane.. If you think that the mens movement is something new, think again. If you want to know the sort of society that will result from this movement, all you have to do is move to iran.
the next step for Feminism is to seperate family men out from the macho monsters that hide behind them.
he wrote an article about me out of the blue. I had no idea who he was until he wrote it.
Obviously the MRAs are scared of me. I've never actually said i was a feminist. All i say is that i don't believe in men and i don't believe in their movement. If you want to know how fickle, and brainless the mrm is, go in pretending to be a feminist. They will never forgive you and what you say, is irrelevant.
Its a bit like when they used to hate communism. Commies they called them!
however, if you asked them what a communist is, they didn't know! they just know they hate them. That's the mrm for you. They used to hate communists, then muslims and now women!
their solution is a good mirror so that they can take a good look at themselves!!!
while they are busy with that, the alternative to the mrm is a new type of feminism, one that is not around yet, and i'm trying to make that clear. It needs tweaking and cutting round the edges a bit and needs thinking women to acknowledge the mistakes made.
Perhaps we need some clear headed men with no score to settle to help us along the way too
Lucia Vega, What you say is correct in situations. The MRM is not naive to men's faults but they should not be expected to dwell on that when they are fighting for men's rights. That would defeat the purpose.
You would like the MRAs in NZ. They also work with women. Women are also having a hard time in the Family Court and with child support.
As a group the MRAs here are targeting the FC and the way CS is being worked. There is a lot of bad things happening to those that pay here.
We also have a huge group of many groups and individuals that are lobbying for families.
Our Government is very feminised and the next election should bring a change of Government. Unfortunately we have swung so far left that the right is now centre right. So I doubt we will be going backwards. And plus it was the feminists goal to change laws that will last for hundreds of years. Some of them in my eyes are good. I like that we look after the poor, disabled, sick and give a helping hand to those who need it as a society so I am a bit of a socialist.
I love the MRA in my country. They do all this work voluntarily. They walk men and women right through their court cases and they always encourage families to work together. I suppose when there is much pain people work well as a team. It hasn't always been this way (as per normal for any groups like this) but now it is very strong.
Something else you need to consider with the MRM is that there is a lot of testosterone around. I don't think it is fair to just expect males who have been married to somehow suddenly have things sorted out.
You haven't yourself actually worked with men going through the FC. It is biased but that is also changing. Mind you the mothers think it is biased to them also. I have recently worked with a woman whose ex was going to abduct their child. If you play the game with the FC you can win. It shouldn't be about a winner and a loser.
It has been nice to talk with you. I am not anti either side but because I work in this, I do see the problems having 2 sides that don't work together. I wish that to change ASAP.
Oh, on another note. The group that is making the changes in the FC and fro benefits is the Grandparent's group. Have you ever heard of Grandparents raising grandchildren?
So as you can see this is far bigger than the men you have been speaking to on the net.
Lucia Vega, Actually I am an anti feminist. I would say that most people working on the ground are anti feminists but not anti women's rights. Even most of the feminists dislike the radical feminists. I suppose they are not really feminists then. lol
Interesting exchanges..
I agree with much, but not all..
For example, the majority of men are not happily married, hardly possible if most children are born out of wedlock and if one is to take the "real" definition of a happy family as being happily married with both parents, then, that statistic will be further challenged!
I dont believe that the current crop of MRA's have the answers. nor do the established feminists..
The latter are showing their contribution to family breakdown and many social problems today, the former are just making knee-jerk reactions to them!!
If there are any "easy" answers, I suggest that if we want to make life "better" for families, we would do well to get back to basics and take things from there..
Gender polar solutions are destructive, but gender hermophradims is unreal..
Guess we should aim for a society that accepts nature and does not make such great efforts to change it..
For men, for women, for the children that will one day grow up to be one or other..
Lets base society on the FAMILY, not on trying to get the edge for one gender or the other..
Thats just my view of it all, and frankly, I am ready to quit trying to educate the MRM as its a road no nowhere that is simply responding to the feminists with a similarly gender polarised outlook, or a gender hermophradite (unrealistic) solution..
I have noted, what with gullible low-intellect buffoons and out-and out plonkers, the few folk with much sense to speak are going to have a hard time convincing the normal mainstream of society that their "victim" status is not, at least partially, earned by their own actions..
Maybe this debate would be better suited to your forum?:)
Hi Drex, welcome in.
Maybe this debate would be better suited to your forum?:)
Are you talking to me?
With no disrespect, I am just having a conversation with LV. And I am enjoying it.
This is not so much as a debate from my part although when I look back we have been looking at both sides to this.
But just for you. Why are you trying to teach the MRM? It will go where it is going all by itself.
And having men's rights out there will help families more than you know. How does one give respect to males if the media and the advertising and the Government discard them so easily? How do children and females respect men with the constant ignoring of women's faults and only showing men's faults.
Have you ever noticed how the news on TV uses PC. If a male kills or harms a female or does some crime they say, "A man did it" but if a female does a crime similar they say, "A person did it" In both scenarios our brain thinks it is a man. That can't be good for males of any age.
Changing little things like this, will make a difference. Don't you think?
Maybe this debate would be better suited to your forum?:)
julie, he means my forum, thats got about 5 members, 2 of which are me, one is drex, and the other two i have no idea about. Why don't you join? then there'll be 6!
honestly, i think between you, you two are maybe the most difficult people i've come across in the mrm to put in a box.
i know somewhere lost in the ocean of bizarre occurances that are drex's mind, are some answers. Maybe for women, as well as men.
i tend to like people who i can't predict whats coming next, are you like that too julie?
otis is definately like that, but he's a bit younger i think.
there are some other people i don't mind in the MRM, but as a group, i think they represent going backwards, rather than forwards, for both men, and women.
feminism isn't perfect and it needs to be cut around the edges and chopped up put in a cake tin, stirred around a bit, add a few blokes and then maybe we'll be getting somewhere.
i know somewhere lost in the ocean of bizarre occurances that are drex's mind, are some answers. Maybe for women, as well as men.
I tend to like people who i can't predict what's coming next, are you like that too julie?
Pretty much.
So where is this forum?
julie:
there is a link on the right hand side of the page, but here is another
http://luciavega.proboards101.com/index.cgi
it'll probably take a year or so to get going
im still trying to work out what its going to be about. probably just wierd sociological topics and interesting stuff
Thanx Lucia Vega,
When you are not so busy with your commitments, you can look at my site now and then also.
www.singleparents.org.nz
We have just started a discussion on how they are going to deal with the mothers. Feminism is not just about taking the men's rights away. It is also about taking the women's rights away.
From what i have seen of the mrm they may as well join forces with the feminists!
Both expect the state to control everything and both seem to want to interefere in an unhealthy way with personal relationships..
Yes Drex, it is funny how the MRM and feminists seem to have the same complaints but about each other.
In some ways they have joined forces but then I don't think you actually MAKE things fair because fairness is also a perception.
yeah they are both the same, but coming from totally different extremes. i think that neither has any ability to understand the other. its probably why they seem so unhappy and angry all the time.
still, we all go through difficult times don't we?
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